Dr. Gianna Talone-Sullivan received her Doctorate in Pharmacy at the University of Southern California (USC). She then proceeded into corporate pharmacy where she practiced in the executive leadership realm of healthcare organizations, non-profit organizations, program development, marketing & board of directors development.

In 1989 she experienced a Divine encounter which led her to leave her corporate career to fulfill a Mission she had been invited to develop.  

She founded a medical mobile health care clinic called Mission of Mercy (MOM) whose mission is to “restore dignity healing through Love.” MOM is celebrating its 26 year of operation and is now a national charitable non-profit organization that provides free medical, dental, prescriptions, ancillary services and up to 12 free surgeries a year to the underserved population.

She is the author of several books titled “I Am Your Jesus of Mercy” and is also the United States representative for the worldwide Armata Bianca Apostolate, which promotes the Fatima message to the children of the world.  

In September 2020 she became a Certified Happiness Coach with Marci Shimoff’s, Happiness for No Reason Program; 7 steps to being happy from the inside out. Marci Shimoff is a celebrated transformational leader and #1 New York Times bestselling coauthor of Chicken Soup for the Woman’s Soul and a featured teacher in The Secret.  

Gianna is available to inspire and fill your hearts with joy, peace, and clarity.

Unknown Speaker 0:00
Your journey has been an interesting one up to hear you’ve questioned so much more than those around you. You’ve even questioned yourself as to how you could have grown into these thoughts. Am I crazy? When did I begin to think differently? Why do people in general appear so limited as Bob process? Rest assured, you are not alone, the world is slowly waking up to what you already know inside yet can’t quite verbalize. Welcome to the spiritual dough podcast, the show that answers the questions you never even knew to ask. But he’s the answers to questions about you this world, the people in it? And most importantly, how do I proceed? Now moving forward? We don’t have all the answers, but we sure do love living in the question. Time for another head of spiritual dub with your host, Brandon Handley. Let’s get right into today’s episode.

Brandon Handley 0:41
Hey, there’s spiritual dope. I’m on here today with Dr. Jana to low Sullivan, who received her doctorate in Pharmacy at the University of Southern California. She then proceeded into corporate pharmacy where she practiced the executive leadership realm of healthcare organizations, nonprofit organizations, program development, marketing and Board of Directors development. In 1989, she experienced the divine encounter which led her to leave her corporate career to fulfill a mission she’d been invited to develop. She founded a medical mobile health clinic called Mission of Mercy, whose mission is to restore dignity healing through love. Marlon celebrating his 26th year of operation is now a national, charitable, nonprofit organization that provides free medical, dental, dental, and prescriptions and ancillary services and up to 12 Free surgeries a year to the underserved population, sees the author of several books titled I am your Jesus of mercy and is also the United States representative for the worldwide Armada by Bianca apostolate was for most the Fatima message to the children of the world. On top of this, she is also a happiness coach. And we’ll dig into some of that. I am so happy to have you here with us today.

Gianna Sullivan 2:00
John, how are you? I’m great. Now that I’m on your show, Brandon, thank you for having me. Welcome to all your your fans who are joining us today. It’s quite an honor. And so very privileged,

Brandon Handley 2:16
fantastic, me as well, you know, kind of this privilege to even be able to have the platform and be able to hop on and share it out. So I like to start these off with the whole idea that you and I are vessels for Source Energy, right? Like, you know, there’s something out there that or even within us that we’re connected to, that can only be expressed in like a certain way. And oftentimes when when we’re having this conversation, there’s something coming through you today, John, that can only, like, be delivered through this platform to an end listener that needs this message. What is that message today?

Gianna Sullivan 3:00
Well, if you had asked if we were to join, maybe, you know, a few months ago or something, maybe it would have been different. But today, I would say how could anyone see that there isn’t a storm? If you know what I mean? Arising I mean, there’s something near I think we’re all feeling it. We’re all being restricted on various levels. And that controls that are there are many controls that are being placed on not only locally, but peoples of all countries. And so I’m just wondering who’s behind this outrageous manipulation that’s telling people threatening people what they can or cannot do. And, and whoever it is, is behind liberal political, medical, spiritual leaders. They’re just mandating all these different types of restrictions. And a lot of people are frightened by that. A lot of them are angry by that. So it’s just not the President’s or something. Something bigger, something else is behind this. And you know, who’s telling social media to go out there. And these big giants who are spending millions of dollars to promote misinformation, and even to get certain people elected? Who is I guess, it’s a storm that I see that sneering and who is behind this media, this mainstream media mean? And then I could even go into immigration. I can even talk to you about that. I mean, who’s who’s driving and profiting from the chaos and injustice? Right. They’re from all fonts of, of immigration. If you look at it, so you got health care workers, you’ve got first responders, you’ve got teachers, you’ve got policies. You know, even law enforcement professionals, people are asked to resign people are leaving. I don’t know. There’s I just sense that there’s a storm arising.

Brandon Handley 5:35
Yeah. Hey, I mean, it’s it’s we’re living in some some really interesting times. I would I would not hesitate to say, and I know that I’ve said it before. I feel like we’re living in the, in the midst of a revolution. Right. I think that. And within revolution, there’s also revolt. Right? There’s going to be most likely and there already has been I think that we’re seeing some type of revolts. We’re seeing revolts right now within the workforce, right, the great resignation, there’s a there’s a revolt. And within revolution, we also need to think of that the cycle, right? of you know, whatever’s happening right now, our past we’re really trying to disentangle from that and move forward. And I think to your point, there’s a lot of new puppet mastering going on to try and maintain the grasp, by instilling fear by saying, oh, you know, you people over here, you got to stay here, you people over here, you’ve got to do this, you’ve got to you can’t, you can’t visit these people. Right? Oh, here’s like the top five places you can’t visit, right, and really just kind of a tremendous fear tactic that’s being media driven, and all this other stuff. 100% there is a storm, a foreman, and I think that we’re definitely in the midst of it. You know, all that being said, John, I mean, your happiness Coach, how do we how do we, you know, find ourselves let’s, let’s talk a little bit about your journey. Right, let’s talk a bit about your journey. And then, at some point, let’s lean into the idea that, you know, all this is going on? I’m hoping you say yes to this. But can we still find happiness in all these things that are going on?

Gianna Sullivan 7:24
So, okay, so even in the midst of a storm, I mean, there’s various ways to look at all of this, okay? We know for a fact that genetically, we are composed. And born with happiness, we that’s been proven scientifically. So if you looked at a pie chart, 50% of our happiness is genetic. And then the other 40% Are your habits, how you’re brought up what you’ve been exposed to your neural path, pathway, pathological cellular pathways, I mean, all of that is, can either be positive or negative, and then that’s 90%, right there that 40% was, you know, positive, that would be 90% 50. And 40%, happy would be 90%. But that 40% is the issue, the other 10% to make the 100% is really issues in your life that are transitional. Yeah. I mean, if you’re not going to be happy, 100% all the time. It’s always how you react, what your emotion is what you can do to cross check yourself. On, I mean, you there are points in your thought processes that you can change. So we know for a fact that we have 60,000 thoughts a day. And we also know that tomorrow, you will have 95% of the same thoughts that you had yesterday will be the same thoughts a few bad today that Did you know that now checking your thoughts, think about it, you’re gonna have the same thoughts or things that we’re always kind of thinking about. So if there are 95% of the thoughts that you had yesterday, the same day, then we’re being robbed of happiness, just based off the things that we’re thinking,

Brandon Handley 9:29
Alright. Let’s, um, let’s, I definitely want to dig into it. Right. I want to talk a little bit about your journey into this space, though. So so, you know, even first and foremost, right? With the amount of time that we have, definitely want to understand, you know, you you were in your work in the corporate life, yeah, doing the, you know, nine to five or as we know, corporates can be like, you know, 6080 hours a week, you know, just kind of like this life suck, especially as you’re trying to propel yourself into This this, the things everybody tells us that we’re supposed to want. Right. And then you had a divine encounter, which inspired you to leave your your corporate gig. And I love that, you know, I don’t know if this is on purpose in your webpage, but you were led to fulfill a capitalized mission. Love to hear more about that, and then just kind of how that integrates. And let’s work our way up to some happiness pieces that we can share out.

Gianna Sullivan 10:32
So I was vice president of a major health care company. And really, I enjoyed that position tremendously. I was very much of a yuppie. And so born and raised Arizona, got my BA in chemistry at ASU went off to California. And I got my doctorate and did my internships and at clerkships, UCLA. I mean, I was a yuppie, all the way enjoyed it all, took my boards, pass them and went right into administrative work and stuff like that. So I thoroughly enjoy I still love pharmacy is my profession for 36 years, but I, you know, I was at the top of my career is how I really would say it. And yes, I did, I did have a divine encounter. And it was an amazing experience. It mean, regardless of your religion, I can only enlighten it. I mean, yeah, to something like St. Paul, you know, like the scales fall off your eyes. It was like, all of a sudden, I had this illumination, enlightenment of body, mind and soul. And I was invited by God. And when you have a divine encounter, I can tell you, Brandon, you there’s no way you can fake this. I mean, it will last for you forever, you will never forget the moment and what happens to you. So that I was invited by God to leave my current position as I knew it. And then to help the Lord. restore dignity, healing through his love. And now he didn’t give me the tools how to do that. But medicine being my background in health care. That’s why I chose the name Misha mercy. And the only key was I was going to them, they weren’t to come to me. So I started a medical mobile clinic to go out to them. We started with like six volunteers and took a while to get it, you know, you have to do your research geographical area and, and people just don’t buy into what you’re doing. So did take time and you take baby steps, the steps. And so that’s what happened. Then I took the plunge and purchased an RV. That was like $40,000 for $2,000. I only had $2,000 in my account. And then two weeks later, a benefactor came and paid it in full. And then we were able to they meaning the group that I got together about a few of us that we were able to furnish refurbish the mobile, RV to a mobile clinic. And that’s how it started. This is was us. 20 stat. 27 years ago. Now we’re national nonprofit.

Brandon Handley 13:50
I think I think that’s fantastic. Let’s talk a little bit about the you know, we can talk a little bit about that experience that you had, but it’s been my it’s hard to translate, right? It’s like you said, you know, it’s something you can’t fake. Right?

Gianna Sullivan 14:09
You and leave your job for the amount of money I was getting to get nothing.

Brandon Handley 14:14
Well, you know, let’s talk about that. That too. Right. So the whole the whole I’m not, I’m not a biblical scholar. But there’s the whole idea of sell everything give it away or let go of it and move on to this next piece. Right sounds kind of like yeah, that’s what you did you like you You went all in Who you talking to about this vision? And what what are people saying to you and how do you kind of move past that?

Gianna Sullivan 14:41
Well, I talked to everybody about the vision and and then I had a few friends that I knew that incorporated the company and started in Arizona actually 91 and then by I moved to the Pennsylvania Maryland area in 93 and then 94 actually launched in the Maryland area. And so yeah, that the the whole mission statement, I’m not afraid to talk about God or the reality of that. And, and the idea of restoring dignity Healing Through love is and I never was financially compensated all these years, I worked part time in different pharmacy jobs to support myself. But the idea is you you need to give without seeking constellation in return in the joy of that, whether it’s a listening ear or a hug or a smile. It’s It’s amazing. So we just believe the mission of mission, Mercy believes that the moment you give, is the moment you actually received.

Brandon Handley 15:47
Yeah, I mean, there’s a lot there’s definitely a lot in the giving, right. The took a course, I think it was the Indian School of Business. And one of the one of the pieces that we had to do was, it wasn’t just to kind of, I don’t know, if you’ve ever done these kind of pay it forward, things were like, hey, whoever’s behind me want to buy them a cup of coffee, but I don’t want to see it, don’t tell who it was. And you kind of sneak out of there, right? You don’t want you to like peekaboo. And you’re, and then instead of doing that, they said, stay there and witness it. Right? Because it’s that giving that gift and seeing the suction that to me is is very rewarding. And I never really had had that experience before. So you know, definitely in giving gifts and and giving, but like, just the reward of giving something and seeing somebody truly appreciate it and enjoy it unexpectedly. Right, that gift of giving. Yeah. And then, you know, you the other part, too, is is giving without the expectation to get something back, knowing that your whatever you’re doing, you’re doing it from your heart and not with an expectation of return is that exactly in line with where you’re at,

Gianna Sullivan 17:04
there are three, three levels of giving. One is you give because we have an obligation, there was something that needs to be done with our economy or population or whatever. For something like government, we have to do something about the issue. That’s one level given the second level giving is you give and you volunteer, let’s say because it makes you feel good. But then there’s the third level, which is the level that I congratulate all the volunteers that mission mercy or any other organization is that you give without seeking compensation in return. Right, because you are the fiber, then you are joining you are, you’re part of a family. You don’t do something to feel good, or get paid to do something not out of obligation. But you do something, because you’re just you’re that family, you, you have a big heart, and you want to give people hope. And you want to extend the love to make them feel valued. So whether you see one person in a day, or 100 people, or more than that in a day, you treat each of those people as if they’re the most important person, each person is if they’re the most important person that comes to you that day. You they need to be valued and they need to feel loved. They need they’ll know if you’re authentic or not. Right.

Brandon Handley 18:40
Now, yeah, you can’t fake it. And you’ll know, right? You’ll feel it in yourself. If you’re faking it, it’s kind of like a It’s kind like a faded copy of the real thing. So one of my questions, those as you’re heating this calling, what was there any fear involved of what people might think of what you’re doing? Have some of those conversations again, you said your top of your career, and you said, You know what? I got this other thing I got to do, delivered by God. It’s in my heart. I know it’s the right thing to do. What’s the response from people who are close to you?

Gianna Sullivan 19:25
Pretty amazing. And, you know, you become a loner. And there are a few that will stay by you. Maybe your family won’t even stay by you have to have a conviction that stronger than that and and trusting God that what was told will unfold. And do you have to have that belief and faith and, and trust. So we all have that power. We’re all empowered with self reliance and God. So it was it fee, I remember people leaving some money on my screen to pay my electricity bill. So it got to a point where it was a little. Yeah. Just doesn’t happen right away. I mean, you have to work through the process. So, but it did turn around and things started slowly in a positive direction.

Brandon Handley 20:30
Right. And I just want people to hear that, right. I mean, because we still have, I think, this tribal instinct to not get thrown out of the tribe. For eight. If I if I get thrown out of the tribe, I’m on my own. The bears and the lions are gonna eat me, and I’m not gonna be able to do it. So I better stick with these guys, even though I’ve got this thing on my heart. And what you’re talking about is, you know, kind of leaning into it, like you said, Trust that process. Follow what you believe to be true. And nobody else needs to believe what’s on your heart except for yourself. Is that fair to say?

Gianna Sullivan 21:07
God, it will happen. If it isn’t, then it will. How do you know it takes you just have to walk the process. You have to? I mean, there’s certain things I mean, as a health care provider, I knew what needed to be done as a health care provider. If you’re starting a medical mobile clinic, you know that things need to be done. You know that there’s research geographically, you need to know where the need is, you need to know if there’s, you know, if there’s any where you have to learn about benefactors. I mean, you have to do your your homework investigation. And if you’re starting a nonprofit, and I was in Arizona at that time, let me tell you, Arizona, full full of nonprofits, it’s a competitive competition area, you got the heart sociation, you got the kidney, you got me everyone is competitive. And they are big time donors. So if you’re trying to start a nonprofit, you know, people just companies just don’t give to nonprofit unless you can show or prove that you have a track record. Okay, so you have to build up your clientele. Or you have to find the right benefactor who believes so much in your passion that they give because of what you believe, and they buy into what you love. And then that’s what happened with me. And my first $100,000 came from a benefactor in Arizona.

Brandon Handley 22:46
Yeah, I mean, I think that it makes sense, right? If you’re, if you’re talking from the heart, and this is something that you believe you’ve done your work, you’re gonna you know, I hate to say Providence, right, especially in the work that you’re doing, but you kind of understand that that’s possible. And even to your point where there’s going to be taught, there’s the possibility where somebody is leaving money on your screen for the electricity, you know, water, what are you thinking in, in? In that, when that’s happening? Are you thinking, oh, man, I’m gonna have to get back into work, I’m gonna have to do this thing I can’t keep going on? Or are you still open to faith and belief in that time? Just to talk to me a little bit about getting through those times humiliating,

Gianna Sullivan 23:30
okay, you’re making six figures, and then you drop down and nothing. Chris, you have some money, of course saved or whatever to live off of. But the fact is, if your life is totally changing, and you’re not networking within that type of business, then you’re trying to launch something else. You got, you’ve got homework to do, and you’ve got to self check yourself. So a lot of people who believe if you have a divine encounter, that you’ve got it made that you know, everything is going to be flower, no, just perfect for you. That’s not true. That’s not true. I mean, God might give you a divine mission or even a message, but that doesn’t mean that you’re going to have your whole outlook in your private life. All explained and outlined for you, okay? So if anything, you have to be strong enough. Pray. As for me, I’m Catholic. So sacraments are important. Going to Mass every day praying the rosary, those things are fundamental, very critical. And then you have to be the light for others. Even if you don’t feel like being the Liferay even if you don’t feel good. There are people out there that don’t feel good either. But maybe it’s it’s your light that makes somebody else feel better. Everyone wants to be loved. Okay, not and I’ll tell you my family didn’t really jump on board. It took us A couple more than a couple years, few years, several years to finally jump on board. So, alright, so is it a walk you walk alone? Well, if you believe that you live your life alone, and you don’t believe God’s with you walking that life with you, then, you know, I would regroup with yourself and know that you’re never alone. You’re never alone.

Brandon Handley 25:26
Yeah, I mean, that’s, that’s a big message from you know, spiritual dope podcast, right? It’s big messages. You know, what you’re talking about is, it’s available to everybody. Right? It’s a boils down to a choice and the decision whether or not to accept that into your life. And then once you do you find exactly what you said, you’re not alone. Can you bet you maybe you’ve been trying to do it alone your entire life. But but then it boils down to a point of like, alright, well, apparently, there’s something out there that that can help me. Right. And, and leaning into accepting that divine grace and accepting divinity and accepting that try to go at it alone. Even in any way, shape, or form, it’s almost, it’s almost full foolishness, right? To kind of think about it that way. So I appreciate you sharing, you know, kind of what that walk is like, right? Because I think that it’s very important. I think that it’s important to heed your calling, right? What is your calling to lean into it and to know that while there may be some areas of challenge that sounds like you know, you’re living the life that you feel is driven by purpose, and you’re doing it with intent, with love and kindness, and caring? And while you may have enjoyed your job, as a VP, would you say that this is more fulfilling for

Gianna Sullivan 26:52
you? Oh, my gosh, yeah, sure. Sure. Even you can even there’s no measurement. It’s timeless. It’s the it’s the fulfillment is is beyond is just, I mean, now, it’s been so many years, it’s just here, it doesn’t matter what what work I do. My outlook is always to serve the most vulnerable or to help the underserved population or to help to general anybody who is hurting, and just needs to be refocused. Yeah, you know, if you’re Christian anyway, if you’re Christian, don’t believe that Christ died for you. And then you’re saying you’re alone? Or you’re, you know, then is almost blasphemous. How you Why would he? You know, what? The purpose being Franklin, if, if, if you don’t believe in resurrection in our life, and there is a there’s a real guy stand, for sure. So people think that if you don’t see it, then it’s not true. But now there’s a lot of things you see and you think is true. A true?

Brandon Handley 28:08
Oh, yeah, for sure. For sure. I think I think too, you know, what we see less than 1% of the visible frequency, we hear less than 1% of, you know, the, you know, sound waves out there. I wouldn’t be super surprised if, you know, we’re walking through, you know, we’ll call it like, bodyless souls or something, right? Like, you know, something like that. So, just because we can’t see it doesn’t mean that is not there. Just because we can’t hear it doesn’t mean that something’s not talking to us. So I get it, you know,

Gianna Sullivan 28:44
purposes. Me it. You know, the Lord says, where your heart is there to is your treasure. If you have that flame in your heart going, keep it tight, so nothing blows out that flame.

Brandon Handley 29:01
Right? Yeah. I love it. I love it. Well, I want to I want to jump forward a little bit into your happiness work, your happiness coaching. So you’re doing this you got your hands full with running when running this program running mom. Now, what makes you decide to now pick up and lean into happiness coaching?

Gianna Sullivan 29:24
Well, I actually when I was on mission, mercy I was I witnessed a lot of people who are very happy coming on board and being treated getting free prescriptions, free health care, free ancillary services, etc. free dental care. But that was the happiness. That was a relief for them. But interiorly more in debt in debt it within them was something still lacking. And so I wanted to them to know, you know how valued they really are, and how whole you can be and how you look at a circumstance, there is a happiness continuum. And so we can control our thoughts we can either be Teflon or Velcro, we have a way to, we know, our thoughts and our outcomes and how we interact, how we treat ourselves how we can temper our thoughts and our emotions can really make a difference today. And so I wanted to take the extra step. And in that is the spiritual component. So some people that I do happiness coaching with has the spiritual component, they want that spiritual component. And then there’s the more secular just wanting to know the principles of the fast track to happiness or seven level appears like a house, there are seven cores to it. But the most two important one is, you know, the the foundation being held accountable, understanding what’s happening, where’s your mind, whereas your thoughts, and then after, can grasp that you move on to the heart, to the soul to relationships, you know, there’s a roof, it’s like a house. So each one is different, you can’t do everyone in an hour, you know, you’d have to take the full

Brandon Handley 31:29
class. know for sure. So I mean, you’ve got let’s, let’s touch on the the seven pillars, right that you’ve got there, you touched on a little bit, but let’s just kind of talk talk through them. And maybe, let’s talk a little bit about how people are able to find pockets of happiness amidst the storm that we are talking about.

Gianna Sullivan 31:50
Okay, so that one is, okay. So the whole purpose of what something like this would be is, you want to learn some practical tools that you can use that you can every day, immediately try and raise your happiness level. Okay? So you want to try and understand what that key is to create a foundation of happiness. The idea of the happiness that I try and teach is happiness from the inside out. Happiness is a state of being, it’s not something that happens that causes you happiness, the true happiness that I try and teach is happiness is a state of being, regardless of the circumstances that happen within your life. Now, again, Brendon is not like, I would tell you that if any, whatever, you might have a bad day. Okay, so does that mean that you know, you’re gonna Oh, just be so chipper? No, I mean, you know, there’s a way to look at things there’s, there’s, there is a connection that you can click on, in, in this happiness forum, there is feelings of contraction, you know, are you feeling resistance or fear? Or are you malaise? You know, there’s a feeling of separation? That’s something can contraction, you know, you’re not feeling good? Or are you being expanded expansion is a big thing. You know, are you optim mystic Are you know, feeling flow well, being ease? Creativity, you’re feeling good. So you’re Oh, those are your tools of magnets one way or the other, that you can figure out if, if you’re on the right course. So always, no matter what your sentiment is, double check your thoughts, feelings by expansion, or contraction. Okay, so because your brain has neural pathways, and those neuro habits are things that will give you different emotions, it’s like addictions, you know? And that’s why they say, Well, you know, I have a problem and you’re going to go to whatever rehab or wherever it is, that 30 day process, they say it takes 20 to 30 days, is because you have these neural pathways in your brain chemicals. And so once you start thinking and a one way, then that becomes a habit, and then you start thinking that way and thinking that way and thing, and it becomes a natural habit, where it’s always a negative, negative, and that’s happens a lot with substance abuse. It’s a natural response, because that’s all they’ve been trained to do. And so you have to get out of that. You have to train your brain to think differently, different neural pathways different cellular membranes that memory pathways that will help train you to think opposite positive. And until that becomes the ordinary way of your thinking. So it takes about, you know, 2030 days, it doesn’t happen overnight. So some people use a rubber band that when they think a negative thought, you say, hey, stop, and then you just distract yourself or think of something. So it’s uncomfortable a little bit in the beginning until you get your, your, you know, roll on format of what it is. Some people I tell, go look at yourself in the mirror, and every day for 20 days, for one minute or two minutes, I want you to say how I’m beautiful, I’m intelligent, I’m, I’m handsome. I’m, you know, I’m, I’m, you know, creative, I help people, whatever. Yeah, I love my mom, I love my dad, I love you know, little kids have no problem doing that, you know, and they’ll even clap their hands and do a dance as they’re doing it. So we have to learn to love ourselves and be comfortable with ourselves, even when we don’t feel good about ourselves, we can understand that there is a challenge or something happening out there. Well, it doesn’t mean we can’t change it, but we can certainly change our attitude about it. So the pillars are, you know, like I said, it’s, I call it the home of happiness. Okay. So the top is your life purposes is the roof. Do you want me to continue on? Did you want to say some?

Brandon Handley 36:42
Looking for the mute button. I’ll tell you what, let’s let’s walk through, right, let’s walk through it, because I want to make sure that we talk about the pillars and definitely got thoughts and things we could talk about. But I just want to make sure that we leave time to walk through these pillars. And maybe we’ll talk a little bit about those. Okay,

Gianna Sullivan 37:00
I don’t want to go through every single one of them because they take too long.

Brandon Handley 37:04
Yeah, no, no, just hit them on a high level. John. Okay.

Gianna Sullivan 37:08
So are we on mute? Are we so

Brandon Handley 37:11
we’re on the go?

Gianna Sullivan 37:17
Here Amazing how you doing? Okay, so you had the life purpose, we had a roof over our heads, you know, we don’t want a leaky roof. You know, in a hurricane situation, I think we have a roof over our head, right? So, do we have a roof, we look at that, then we have our mind, their pillars mind, our mind, our thoughts, our heart, our heart is the key, the key to the soul. And where, like I said, Where your treasure is there too as you’re okay. And then we’re the body. Of course, that is if your body is in alignment, you know, quantum light, even you know, a lot of people do yoga and stretch, but the body is important to balance. So and then there’s the soul. And the soul is your deep intimacy with God. And different relations, I mean, different religions. So it is your overall essence of who you are and your soul being free. Because it’s captive within your body. So that soul lives forever, and you make a choice of where your soul goes. So then there’s CEUs 12345, okay, then there’s the responsibility that we call the foundation to the house. So that means being held accountable for some of the things that you do or not do, okay? So you, you want to be held accountable for things that you have done. And we look at that. And then there’s the last is the, the garden of the house, the garden is your relationships, and how you choose them. And whether you desire or not, it’s important to choose what is purposeful for not only you but for the other party. Pretty much that’s it in an in a nutshell. So the idea is that we try and teach to do what you love and love what you do. And, sure,

Brandon Handley 39:41
I mean, I think one of the one of these pieces that I know that I personally struggled with in the past so every once in a while struggle with is you know, is that roof, right? You know, like you’ve done you found your passion and you’re following your inspiration and your serving others. How, what are some ways that you teach people to find their purpose?

Gianna Sullivan 40:12
Well, everyone has a dream. And there’s a way to live your dream. And you have to embrace your desires. And based off your dreams and desires, you try and seek to fulfill them, and find out what that channel is to do it. And remember, you have to use that continuum happiness chart thing I said, the expansion contraction. If you’re really unhappy, if you’re doing something that you’re expanding and embracing and wanting to do, you’ll be pretty low spirited, you know, if you’re happy, well, let’s put it this way, you could be happy for bad reasons. And that happiness is if you’re using unhealthy things to just make you an antidote to make you kind of feel externally happy. But then there is the other happiness, which is, you have a happy for a good, good reason. And that’s really the satisfaction of what you’re doing, you’re healthy, you have healthy expectations. And that then starts moving over to the real and which my desire for people is to have happiness with no reason at all, regardless of what ever is, you have an interior piece. And even if there is a storm, it will balance back because you know, the practices to put in place to maintain that equity and equanimity.

Brandon Handley 41:55
Last little, wasn’t that one I was tripped over? No, no worries, no worries. I think that that I mean, I think that’s great. I think that, you know, trying to understand what your purpose is. And using using that contraction, expansion feeling to kind of be your guiding principle is what I’m hearing you say, right? You know, and like, do I feel like I’m expanding and opening my heart, right? To what it is, I’m doing my feeling in touch with God source universe with this work that I’m doing, or is what I’m doing, kind of eating me alive, right contraction, and just kind of making me shrink and, and not live to the fullest of who I am. And when I when I read a little bit on the pillar of the body, you talk about making yourself happy, nourish your body, energize your body, tune into your body’s wisdom, but I’m just curious, if you’re also talking about the idea of getting these expansive thoughts in our neural pathways and our body being the alchemical, you know, producer that it is, right. And when we have these good or more positive thoughts, we’re creating positive nutrients for ourselves, that our cells become addicted to those positive cells. So in the same way, they would become addicted to the negative energy, right? But just different chemicals, is that what you’re saying?

Gianna Sullivan 43:24
And the body component will, if you’re healthy, will feed into that the the cellular neural path pathways that we were talking about is really the mind aspect that goes into behavior. And you know, attitude is always a big thing to happiness. So if you have a good attitude, you know, it’s expected to that if you have a good attitude, it’ll happiness will come. But beyond that, the behavior and the neural pathways, the cellular negative responses that happen and how you can create new neural pathways. That is, it might be a conscious effort in the beginning, but then later on, it will just become a normal response. It’s a cellular memory that happens. And then it just unconsciously clicks in. So it kind of combines with the brain as always being the big thing because you’re always thinking negative thoughts from the day before. Once you can cap that. That’s why we start with the the foundation of what’s happened to you and then your mind what’s going on there. Then as it goes to your heart and blossoms. You find out how much empowerment that you have in your love that can turn something positive, or something hatreds, almost satanic. It’s amazing. From water, I teach about water theory from the major scientists,

Brandon Handley 44:57
the Hmong Emoto Yeah, when he’s done

Gianna Sullivan 45:01
the, the water experiences of ice and stuff that kids will just put their heart and good things and you get this beautiful image and negative is almost like disgust. And then, but then then you get to the body. So by the time you get to the body, you’re already practicing, you got your mind, and you got your heart. So it’s already like the infusion of a fiber that just kind of flows because, you know, everyone knows if you exercise or stretch or whether even walk or anything like that, what kind of a beat your, you know, circulation and kind of get you going makes you feel high. So, then then, then that’s how then to the soul is, then it’s just a combination of, of absorption of God’s love. And you’re able to receive abundantly.

Brandon Handley 45:57
Yeah, no, I’m in right, definitely in a love it. Definitely, I think that the work that you’re doing both with your mom and with your happiness, work, you’ve got a great passion for it, it comes through, I’m enjoying the conversation, for sure. Unfortunately, we have to kind of dial it down and work our way out. So to that end, jhana what I usually like to do is get around to the whole idea that this is kind of like a spiritual speed dating show, right? And then somebody is going to tune in and be like, you know, should I should I work with Gianna and you know, the the way you answer one or two of these questions, spiritual Bachelorette number one, it could be you know, this could put it all on the line. So let’s just pick a random one. And I think this is a good one. I don’t ask too many people who define themselves as Christians this question. So I think it’s a good one. Is current religion serving its purpose? Now feel free to expand?

Gianna Sullivan 47:02
Well, I think with the COVID. And what’s happened, I think a lot of I’m really disappointed in how a lot of the pastors and religious people have downsized it, and we’re afraid even missionaries, you know, no one wanted to touch some, everyone’s afraid to be with one. If God exists and is with you, then where is your faith and trust? So I think things could have been worked a little better. I think the element of fear and media has caused a tremendous impact. And I’m disappointed I’m on that. So that would be my answer. I don’t think it it could serve better. I hope it does get better.

Brandon Handley 47:45
Fair enough. Would you say that there’s a kind of an erosion of faith then and in this in this crisis, where, you know, if you are truly of faith, then you act that way. I guess it’s,

Gianna Sullivan 47:58
again, it’s fear. And why does that fear come in there? Why did you? Okay, so something happens and Okay, me, it says, You got this, this is like, plague or whatever. And then okay, lets everyone freak out, get it, get the vaccination, without doing any research, no, FDA approved, nothing to understand what it is. And now we just found out you in Maryland, 40% of the people just recently have died of COVID from being fully vaccinated. So because the free cells, the T cells that are free are bound in so they can’t fight your immune, they can’t fight the in fact, yeah. But anyway, so it’s fear. Now, think about it. If you’re rational, and you’re going to do some, you know, stop, just look at it. Okay? Just, you know, take precautions, and just Alright, let’s look at it, and research it, find out information, learn about the pharmaceutical, so that that caused a lot of problems from fear for religion. Unbelievable. It was just amazing. And I I, personally, I’m disappointed on that.

Brandon Handley 49:22
Now, Fair enough, fair enough. That did not go the way that I thought that it may. And that’s, that’s great, right? I mean, that’s part of the reason for these conversations. Let’s see. Let’s go with what is it that prevents people from living to their full potential

Gianna Sullivan 49:42
lack of self love, lack of trust and confidence. You have to be confident not only in yourself, people see if you if people want what you have if you’re the light of God. So part of that confidence. You may not have all the answers yours, but you are a spiritual person of prayer and love. Yeah,

Brandon Handley 50:09
I mean, and I guess accepting that, you know, the church child, oh god, is that one way that you can begin to live to the fullest of your potential? Which is absolutely

Gianna Sullivan 50:22
I mean, self love, you have to be kind to yourself, when people are not counting to themselves. They’re overworked, they’re underpaid, or now they have to resign. Now they’re pressured. I mean, what where does it? Where does it end to? That’s why I think the storms coming is like you said, there are people are ready to revolt. There. There are people that know something’s not right here. And there are people Danford that truth. Right,

Brandon Handley 50:51
right. Now it’s true. All that being said, we do know that we can find pockets of happiness, we do know that there’s somebody that they can reach out to, to, to try to understand what is it you know, so maybe, maybe you feel like you’re down? Or you’re out? Maybe you feel like you’re in such in such a situation? I guess a good question, John. It was like, you know, who would you say right now, is your ideal client for this happiness coaching space.

Gianna Sullivan 51:18
Anyone who has a question, anyone that just desire, openness to to really be fulfilled in life, it’s a freedom. It’s, it’s a freedom of peace. It’s amazing. And that’s not to say negative things would happen. But it’s how you react to is how you think the process is how you work the process. And ultimately, it’s it’s you. It’s it’s all about you. Okay, it’s not about me. I’m happy.

Brandon Handley 51:54
Not it’s I think, to your point, right. It’s, it’s, you’ve been given all the tools, but you may not know how to use them.

Gianna Sullivan 52:03
We all have those gifts. Who doesn’t have a gift? You have a gift, Brandon, that I I would like to have? And maybe I have a gift that you want to have? The puzzle needs everybody to complete it.

Brandon Handley 52:16
Right? No, I agree. John, there’s been a lot of fun, really appreciate our, you know, our ability to connect here today. Where can I send people to find out more about you in the work that you’re doing today,

Gianna Sullivan 52:30
you can go to fast track to And that’s one way. Or there’s another website, the spiritual component as some people want is Our Lady of is another way they’re, they’re both linked together under fast track to happiness. Some people want more spiritual, some people want like the tools. So sure.

Brandon Handley 52:57
No, I get it. I get it. Well, fantastic. I think that the work that you’re doing is amazing. And, you know, keep it up. You’re, I think an inspiration to a lot of people.

Gianna Sullivan 53:05
Are you Brandon, thank you for the time. And thanks for all your listeners, you know, thrilled. Really, pleasure and honor. Thanks. I

Unknown Speaker 53:16
really hope you enjoyed this episode of the spiritual dope podcast. Stay connected with us directly through spiritual co you can also join the discussion on Facebook, spiritual dough, and Instagram at spiritual underscore Joe. If you would like to speak with us, send us an email through Brandon at spiritual Co Co. And as always, thank you for cultivating your mindset and creating a better reality. This concludes the most thought provoking part of your day. Don’t forget to like and subscribe to stay fully up to date. Until next time, be kind to yourself and trust your intuition.

JESSE HARLESS is a leader and facilitator in the addiction recovery and mental health space. As CEO of Entrepreneurs in Recovery®, he facilitates highly experiential online and in-person events that help individuals and purpose-driven organizations harness their strengths, elevate purpose, and build safety. Jesse holds a MA in Clinical Mental Health Counseling from Rivier University and is a FEARS coach, HeartMath® certified trainer, and bestselling author of If Not You, Then Who?. To learn more, visit

Unknown Speaker 0:00
Your journey has been an interesting one up to hear you’ve questioned so much more than those around you. You’ve even questioned yourself as to how you could have grown into these thoughts. Am I crazy? When did I begin to think differently? Why do people in general You’re so limited as Bob process Rest assured, you are not alone. The world is slowly waking up to what you already know inside yet can’t quite verbalize. Welcome to the spiritual dough podcast, the show that answers the questions you never even knew to ask, but knew the answers to questions about you this world, the people in it, and most importantly, how do I proceed now moving forward. We don’t claim to have all the answers but we sure do love Living in the Time for another hit of spirituality

Brandon Handley 0:36
here today with Jesse Harless. He is a leader and facilitator in the addiction recovery and mental health space. as CEO of entrepreneurs and recovery. He facilitates highly experiential, online and in person events to help individuals and purpose driven organizations harness their strengths, elevate purpose and build safety. Jessie holds an MA in clinical mental health counseling from revere University and is a fierce Coach heartmath certified trainer and best selling author of if not you, then who? To learn more, visit Jesse Harless calm. Jesse, you know, you and I were just talking a second here, you and I met. It’s been about four years ago. And it’s just, it’s amazing to see, you were saying you just started your journey, how far you’ve come along now. And even then, I was a fairly heavy drinker, then, at that point in time, and I don’t think we I don’t think we ended up doing a podcast, we did like an introduction, we had some conversation. What’s interesting that I’d like to share with you I mean, it’s been it’s been nearly four years since I’ve had a drink. So it was shortly after you and I connected that, you know, I stopped drinking. And, you know, you had some spiritual experiences myself, which led into spiritual dope. So welcome back. You know, it’s great to reconnect and you know, love to hear kind of what’s going on with you right now.

Jesse Harless 1:57
Yeah, well, congratulations on four years of recovery. That’s awesome. And yeah, what a journey I’m sure that’s been. And yeah, I’m, I’m grateful to be here. I’m grateful to have this discussion with you. And four years later, it’s been it was four years this month, when I started out as an entrepreneur and left my job. So just a

Brandon Handley 2:16
hell of a journey, right? A little a little scary, no doubt, especially especially the past past year or so probably, probably kind of scary for you, in terms of like, how is this all going to work out? I like to start this off with the whole idea, Jessie, that you and I are vehicles for source energy, God energy, whatever, whatever. You know, whatever you feel like that is, and it speaks through us. And if there’s somebody on the other line that’s listening in on the podcast today, that’s going to hear a message that can only be delivered by Jesse through this podcast at this time. What is that message today? Jesse?

Jesse Harless 2:51
Well, I mean, just like anything, I’m living by my heart and intuition, so it’s whatever needs to come out today whoever’s listening to this, you know, that’s what’s going to come out and that’s how I live I’m an intentional person, intentional man, I set intentions every day and you know, that I let go, you know, it’s about who I’m being not what I’m doing. So um, you know, that’s really where I’m at today is just letting go.

Brandon Handley 3:16
Of that is, uh, you know, I had a guy when I was doing the follow up for the rest of this podcast who didn’t like the word intention. And I really, you know, I really couldn’t put a finger on it. Has anybody ever kind of given you pushback or guff using that word yourself?

Jesse Harless 3:38
No, I think if you know the definition, then you understand what it means and you’ll understand that it’s very powerful word just means what is your deepest desire your primary motivation that’s all it is it doesn’t have to be spiritual it’s just your deepest desire primary motivation so instead of me getting up and and saying oh, I’m gonna get seven things done today and I’m gonna do all this stuff and you know, I’m going to do that anyways. So instead I’d rather set intentions and be like, you know, my intention today is to be present. My intention today is to be here now my intention is to be connected. So that’s that’s how I look at it as a way to get clear on my primary motivation and deepest desires for the day

Brandon Handley 4:14
right No, that’s me that’s perfect and and to be honest with you, that was my view. I was like, how can you have a problem with the word intention and there’s there’s something behind it like there’s something kind of like purpose driven. And like you’re saying, you’ve got you following your kind of heart and intuition and you couple that with like, the intention and you’ve got something really the drive after with that. And also saw that, you know, your heart Master Trainer as well, what’s that been like for you to kind of hop into that space? And, you know, are there people out there that might call that pseudo science and then like, what’s your reaction been there?

Jesse Harless 4:50
Yeah, definitely. It made people call, you know, eating fruit pseudoscience. So I mean, it’s just, you know, it’s each his own. And I think, you know, heart math is Something that came into my wheelhouse. After I went to the global event in Mexico, I was a co facilitator, I was invited to go out and meet the founders. And they ran this big global event. So as I facilitated on stage with them, and got to feel out their tribe, and the people who is who are involved over 100 people, I, you know, I said, Wow, there’s something to this, let me investigate it. And they have all this technology, they have all this technology that actually, there’s a piece of technology called the inner balance, and it actually can monitor heart coherence. So if that’s pseudoscience, and I don’t know what sciences, because that’s backed by 400, peer reviewed studies, the the actual work that they’re doing so, you know, if anything, it’s more science and math or science I’ve seen because of the amount of studies they have. So yeah, it’s it’s a really interesting thing to think about. It’s not suffered, we were taught in high school or growing up, but definitely, really something interesting to know that the, the heart in itself can take a memory, and this whole books on this, and the heart has its own nervous system. And I don’t think people understand that, and that’s okay. But it would be worth maybe researching. So yeah, so I got, I got certified and what’s called heartmath interventions program, which is for I’m a clinical mental health counselor. So like, it’s one of the things that I’ve done in a past life, but not really a past life, I just did it for my masters. And so that I did that training, which is for practitioners. And then, and then I went on to do the, what’s called activating the heart of teams, which is bringing heart math into companies. And so yeah, it’s been quite a journey, it’s it’s really interesting to use the self regulation techniques. So they’re not teaching like meditation or teaching self regulation, which is probably the most important thing we could have ever in the history of the world is learning how to self regulate stress during all this pandemic stuff. And all this stuff we’ve been through. So yeah, it’s it’s a really interesting. It’s a really interesting business concept. And I think that once you explore that, it’s backed in a lot of the science of the heart, when we know about heart brain coherence. It’s really much deeper than what I think people understand.

Brandon Handley 7:13
Promise super high level, what is heart brain coherence?

Jesse Harless 7:18
Well, it’s a ways for your, your actual physical heart, to start to get into harmony and balance with your actual mind. And the way that can happen is through deep breathing is one of the ways or this conversation, as we didn’t accommodate this conversation, we’re still gonna, we’re gonna feel a sense of like, not exactly flow, but you could call it that might be one way to describe it. And that’s coherence. It’s like these perfect sine waves. So both of our hearts were connected to the inner balance machine, we would actually see this coherence between both of our heart rate variability. So there’s a space between the heart rhythms or the heartbeat. And the space in between the heartbeat is these heart rhythms, you can measure them. And if you’re angry and resentful, which you might have been before, when you were drinking all the time, that is, we would have hooked up your heart, or let’s say, know your heart, but hooked up your, let’s say, with that machine that actually is Bluetooth and connects to your ear. So we would see through your heart rhythms, that you would have this really this rigidity, we would have saw this rigidity in your heart rate variability, because you’d have been angry, resentful, probably a little snappy. But when we’re when you’re in the flow, and now maybe at times in the morning, during your coffee or prayer, you’re you’re you’re in the state of coherence, and we can actually see these perfect sine waves, which is these perfect waves that are created when you’re in this state of heart, brain harmony. So that’s the most simplest way there’s scientific ways to explain it. But to keep it really simple, there’s just the heart and the mind coming into balance and coming into harmony. And you do it all the time. It’s happening all the time. But you know, you can also measure it now, which is kind of neat.

Brandon Handley 9:02
And that, being able to measure that does not allow you to figure out ways to get into coherence. And if I’m kind of following a little bit here, that would also help you and your self regulation.

Jesse Harless 9:14
Exactly. It’s all about self regulation. Because if you’re in a state of coherence, you are regulating your state, your emotional state, your spiritual state, your mental state, it’s coming into balance, so that you’re actually feeling like, Oh, and by the way, you know, the studies that they’ve shown is that even your immune system is boosted. When you’re in a state of coherence, it can actually boost your immune system, it can really release certain hormones that help boost immunity. So it affects your memory, it affects your performance. So if you want to have higher performance, you want to have greater memory, getting in a state of coherence. This is what athletes do is what CEOs text, you know, tech startup people who are really trying to get out there and make a difference in the world. They’ll use these coherence techniques. They’re called coherence techniques. self regulation techniques, but they’re specifically called coherence techniques. And this is a way for the mind to have like, and some people would say, like, if you’re talking about Joe dispenza, and these different people, they would say, you’d have super memory, you know, and Stephen, you know, okay, again, some people would call that pseudoscience. But other people would say, that’s changed my life. So it’s one of those things where, you know, when I was on the outside of it just kind of looking in, it was kind of like, Well, you know, I don’t really know. And then when I was deep inside of it, and having all the studies and reading from all these doctors, and really looking at the work, and then doing it myself for over two years, you know, that’s all the anecdotal evidence and actual peer reviewed evidence that I needed to be like, wow, this is something that’s happening all the time in teams, high performing teams are in a state of group or team coherence. And that’s why that’s why they’re performing at a high level.

Brandon Handley 10:58
So outside of outside of where I work, I’ve never heard anybody else really kind of talk about like high performing teams, right? So love to love to kind of touch on what that looks like. From from this perspective, like what’s it look like to approach like a large business right now. And I think that I think that we’re on like this cusp of of this type of conversation being easier and easier to, to approach like a large business to say, hey, I want to talk to you about your team and your heart mind coherence, and, you know, how that can be beneficial to you? What’s the reception like? What’s I guess? What’s the pitch like for that? And then, you know, what’s the, what’s the reception man?

Jesse Harless 11:39
Well, I, you know, to back up a little bit. So heart math is not my primary selling tool, you know, so I’m a professional facilitator. So I have been trained in what’s called exchange facilitation. And so that’s what actually taught me how to actually get in front of people, and actually how to make conversations worth have having happen. And and create a state where there’s actual opportunities to experience change, where instead of being the, you know, the, the guru with all the answers at the front, the guy the sage on the on the guide on the side, who’s helping people to facilitate conversations worth having that the company is not having. And so coming into a company, that’s primarily what I do is I help them tune into their innate resilience. Now, on top of that, as a small segment of the time I have with them, which could be a 60 minute Lunch and Learn or it could be a two hour three hour event, I will bring in something like a heart brain coherence technique, because this is being used by state troopers. This is being used by the US Navy, this is being used by major institutions. So I’m bringing that in at one piece, to teach them how they can self regulate, which is a huge thing for HR. Because with the rise and climb of marijuana, and rise and climb of alcohol use and mental health decline in the workplace right now, which is probably the worst we’ve seen, there’s never been a better time to start to teach self regulation techniques. But that’s not the primary reason I’m hired to come in. And my primary reason for coming in is to teach innate resilience, to teach them to start to be able to co create or crowdsource their highest strengths, crowdsource success factors of why they’re a high performing team. So that’s kind of primarily where I’m coming in. And then when I’m there, it’s like sneaking the medicine with the cheese. Now that I’m there, now I’m going to teach them a technique that they’re not going to be learning during their nine to five, I’m going to bring it to them as like a heart mass certified trainer or a clinician, because I’m technically a clinician, so I’ll bring into teach self regulation, only for a small segment of it. But it can be a significant opportunity for them to start to just practice deep breathing and heart brain coherence.

Brandon Handley 13:51
Gotcha. Let’s talk a little bit about the path of like, headed into sobriety, right, like what were some of the what were some of the things that flipped a switch for you got you into wanting to be sober? And what are some of the steps that you took, you know, who was suggested before this Jesse? Right? And, you know, the reason I like to do this is one of the one of the things that I was actually interviewed last night. But similar podcast is like, some people forget where they came from, right? And it’s like, well, we’re, you know, Justin, you might have been a sinner before you became a saint. Right? And yeah, so who was the center, Jesse versus the st. Jesse, what we’re seeing right now. And we’re it’s transition,

Jesse Harless 14:38
where you got to ask yourself, what is addiction? What does even mean? So we know what the definition of addiction is, which is, diction is, you know, according to gabber, Ma Tei, is anything that you do repeatedly. That causes pleasure in the short term, but has negative consequences in the long term. So when I say that definition of addiction, I just called out about 99% of your audience out there have addiction or probably 100 Because there’s something in their life that they’re doing that that does have pleasure, maybe they’re eating at night, like 11 o’clock at night, they’re still eating, you know, food addiction, maybe they’re caretaking. Maybe they’re people pleasing. Maybe they’re all about validation at work. These are all addictions. So, you know, for me my addiction, hold on one second, Brandon’s gotta grab a little sip of water here.

Thank you. So, for me, addiction started with trauma, because trauma is the root cause of addiction for most people. Now, when people say think of trauma, they think of sexual abuse, or they think of physical abuse. But that’s not just what trauma is. trauma is includes that but trauma could be your best friend moving away when you were nine years old. Trauma could be the divorce your parents had at seven. There’s there’s many, many different ways that people experienced trauma, which is can be physical, it can affect your nervous system. So for me, when I was a child, my dad left at four never came back, never saw him again in person. And it was also in a car accident, I put him in a coma for 22 days, so so he had brain damage permanently. So at four years old, I experienced significant trauma. And then we moved a bunch of times. So from that point on, it set the stage of how I was going to self regulate my emotions, how I was going to regulate my, you know, my little nervous system. And the reality was, I didn’t have a lot of coping mechanisms. So when it up happening is I found things ways to numb out. And then eventually I picked up physical substances, like drugs, like alcohol. But that didn’t come to later. That came probably when I my first year of college, you know, I dabbled before that. But when I got that first year of college, that’s when I started to really jump into substances and alcohol. And when I flunked out of college, which then added to my trauma, because now I’m the only son to ever attempt college and I failed. I’m the only person in my family to attempt college and I fail. And so now I feel the unworthiness again, which is an addiction and a trauma in itself. Because you can become addicted to your unworthiness. So I actually felt like a piece of shit. And then when end up happening at 20, my father died. And even though he wasn’t in my life, when he died, it was my It was the first time I used cocaine. And so that’s all it took at 20 was for me to have that experience and chase after that for the next two years, to bring me all the way to a place where I was going to go to prison because of it. So that’s kind of what happened to me. That’s my story. And then I found recovery at 22. And it wasn’t, you know, wasn’t like an option. It was like prison or recovery. So I was like, Okay, I’m going to do the recovery, of course, I’m not going to go to federal prison, because I didn’t have state level charges was federal. So I’m like, I’m gonna change my life. So 22 got into recovery. And then from there, recovery kept evolving. So recovery, recovery met at 22. And what it means now for 16 years later, almost is different. But some of the fundamentals are the same. So that’s kind of the higher level backstory of that.

Brandon Handley 18:07
Yeah, thanks for sharing and and Jesse just because, right? Sometimes some people are still stuck maybe in, in between, right in between, like, hey, maybe I’m going through recovery right now, my life has always been shit. And I’ve always had this unworthiness. And, you know, I’ve always been looking for these ways to numb out and I don’t know if my lives are gonna turn around. And you’re proof, though, of like, you know, how can you take what you went through? and turn it around? and turn it into something useful for others, right? How can you All right, now that you’ve been through this process, and you figured out ways to regulate, and you figured out some of the signs and symptoms, and you’ve got a way that you can help people now because of what you’ve been through?

Jesse Harless 18:54
Yeah, exactly. I mean, it’s lived experience, I’ve helped a lot of men, I’ve helped a lot of women throughout my last 16 years, I’m very blessed that I was able to do that. But I also learned a lot about addiction. And I learned a lot about myself. So I think that’s the key is like, at some stage of the game, you have to take a look at your own deal. You have to look at like, what’s really running my life? Am I running my life? Or is my trauma running my life? Am I running my life? Or is my emotional addictions running my life? So that’s really where, you know, for me, I had to take a hard look at that later into recovery. I wasn’t even able to see a lot of that until later on in recovery, to really understand the role trauma plays, and the way that emotional injuries that had happened in the past was still playing into adulthood. And it was causing me not to step into the mature masculine man, it was still keeping me stuck. It was keeping me in that loop of a wounded spiritual ego. And I see a lot of that happening in recovery. So I think that that’s where, for me, that’s the stage of the journey I’m in now. I was I wasn’t there 10 years ago, but now I’m in that stage of the journey of taking a hard look, that there was no initiation into manhood. There was no You know, steps for me to feel whole and feel like I could step up and do what I needed to do. And now today, I do feel that, and one of the reasons is because I have gotten out of my comfort zone, I have faced a lot of fears. And I’ve had done, I’ve done it with a lot of support, because I realized that asking for help was the number one thing that is the wounded masculine, is not asking for help, even in recovery. So that’s where, you know, these are things that took a while to come into my wheelhouse, you know, these are blind spots. But once I surrounded myself with certain men, certain people that could understand that and were living that it was like, oh, wow, this is how I want to live now. And that’s when, you know, entrepreneurship, and this idea of a new type of freedom started to happen, because I realized that like, Oh, I’m still operating in many ways, from loops that are happening when I was 20. So that’s not serving me as a loving adult.

Brandon Handley 20:58
We’re talking about like the wounded ego, spiritual ego, in recovery, and people getting kind of stuck in a loop, what’s something that you’ve been able to learn or figure out that can help somebody get get past that?

Jesse Harless 21:11
Well, I think a lot of people are stuck in there. They’re like, stuck in ways that they don’t even understand like that there is a way out because they’re already in recovery. So they kind of feel like this. Is it. Like, I don’t think it’s better than this, but I’m just grateful. But that’s the whole problem. It’s like you’re, but I’m grateful. It’s like, No, you’re not. So the reality is you’re not grateful. So what are we going to do about it, and part of it is really getting clear of your purpose. When you start to get clear of your purpose, that’s when all of these things pop up. Soon as you’re like, Oh, I’m going to go write that book. That’s when all the boom, that trauma comes up, oh, I’m going to go do this. I’m going to travel here, I’m going to take my family here, I’m going to make this happen, I’m going to start this business, all of a sudden, all these fears come up. And what we can do is we can numb out emotionally, or we can run towards them, ask for help get a coach, talk to someone who’s been there, get a mentor, and then go forward towards the fear, feel the fear and do it anyway. So it’s kind of like that idea that your fears are the compass to where your full potential is. So so that it’s that simple. Like when you if you feeling that way in recovery, and especially if you’re not feeling that way, because you’re not in recovery, either way, you can actually feel it when you go out and go to do something that you know is going to benefit your life and you can’t do it. That’s that those are the things that are blocking you from your purpose. And you can say divine purpose, because I believe we all have one of those So, so the that’s the compass. And so when I, when I left my job four years ago, this month, I came up against the greatest fears I ever faced, because I realized, like, Oh my god, I was playing it small inside of the company, not living out my true potential. And as soon as I left, and I had to figure things out, it was like, Oh, my God, what did I do, but it was also the most exciting journey of my life. Because I could finally start to see how I was playing much smaller than what I’m capable of. And four years later to, it’s still expanding, it’s still growing, you know, because when you’re on your own now you have to figure out how you’re going to make a living without having someone to support and you know, there’s nothing wrong by the way with having a job that’s I’m not knocking a job I had 18 years, but what I’m saying is, for me, I had to make the jump, because I needed to get that that on the other side of that healing so I could help others and serve others.

Brandon Handley 23:30
But know that that’s awesome, right? I think that the idea to have surrounding yourself by some of those strong and encouraging men to get you there. Right? And haven’t haven’t that kind of support. And then you’re talking about that jump to was a have another buddy of mine that I always make the joke of nobody makes their first leap right? It’s really, it is very, very matrix II like you know, trying to make that leap from your corporate your corporate gig and you kind of got almost a protection there, right? And then now you’re like, Alright, well I’m gonna drop all that I’m gonna try and make this jump and in the movie, of course, you know, he falls and hits his face and it’s all kind of bloodied. It’s just like it’s all in the mind, though. Right? In the matrix, right? Real similar to these fears that you’re butting up against the sun was thinking about Jeopardy, that science experiment where you put the penny on top of the water. surface tension never did that. So I mean, basically, you can float a penny on top of water just because of surface tension. That’s real close real similar to our fears, right? You can do it. And there’s that tension right there on the edge. But right past that edge is where the breakthrough happens, right? everything kind of opens up and that’s where the growth is. And it’s unlimited, right? I mean, that’s kind of the beauty of it. That’s what I’m hearing you say to right like it’s just keeps growing and growing and growing. Yep.

Jesse Harless 24:50
Yeah. And never and never stops. Really. Because what I thought I hit I, you know, the beginning of this year was one of the hardest times of my life. And you know, I figured out Well, no, the hardest time My life are over there already past those already had those when I was 22. And it happened this year. And I realized that like, Oh my god, there’s higher ceilings I can get, I can break through higher ceilings, and that’s what happened this year. And it’s the best thing that’s ever happened to me. So that’s where, you know, it’s exciting because there is unlimited growth potential. And I think that’s what life is about is, is living on that edge. But like not living on the edge, so that, like you’re drinking alcohol and doing drugs every day, and you’re barely making it by someone I mean, I mean, like living on the edge of like, Oh, I’m, I’m a little too comfortable right now I need to figure out where can I push myself and also take care of myself, you know, put myself first and have the self care needs, so I can serve my family. But also, what is the edge where where can I be today that can help me to really grow. And for me, like, there’s always an intention. That’s why it goes back to intentions of like, you know, my intention is to live my divine purpose. So what does that mean, exactly. And some days, that could just mean taking care of myself and self care. And I think every day is a good day for that. But some days, it could be like finishing the audio book, it could be doing things that are hard, that take a lot of work. But you know, on the other side of that it’s very rewarding, and it’s serving people it’s serving. My purpose is connected to serving people. So I think, yeah, I think we can we can find a healthy balance between our comfort zone and being outside of our comfort zone.

Brandon Handley 26:28
Yeah, I mean, I’ve got that written down here actually, is my next question says, I can’t cope. What’s the finding the right balance of growth? New, how do you keep yourself from, say burnout? Especially as an entrepreneur especially? Or even how do you find like you were saying, The, there was a point where it was pretty scary, divine intervention, but then it’s like, it doesn’t sound like you’re driven by fear. You know, as far as I can tell, you’re driven by an abundance mindset. How do you maintain that right? Or what do you do when you catch yourself? In a fear based mindset?

Jesse Harless 27:05
Well, I think that a lot of people think abundance is like having a Ferrari, they don’t understand that abundance is simply having food in your fridge abundance is simply having walls, to some, you know, structure of your house to keep you warm, like that’s abundance. And I think as soon as we start tuning into gratitude of what we already have, that’s when we unlock this energy that we’re able to then get more of what we’re already seeking, which really is not money. We’re trying to seek security, we’re trying to seek safety, we’re trying to seek love. So that’s really where that abundance mindset is really useful is like, instead of me getting up and saying, Oh, I wish I had this. And I wish I had that, which is what’s going on a lot of times, even when people are praying. So instead of that, I rather say, Oh, thank you so much that I have that fresh water in my house, and then I have, you know, the food in my fridge. And then I have already what I have like that. Now if I do need my if there are needs and money that is needed to have, it’s like, Okay, well, let me ask for help that, instead of like, trying to say that I have it all figured out, let me actually humble myself, and surrender and be able to ask for help and see what happens and not judge with the support comes from. And I think that was the big epiphany and 2021 for me is asking for help. And then allowing the help to come from wherever is going to come from, because anything else is me controlling that as an ego. That’s an ego based mindset. So I was able to let go. So abundance is a very powerful shift, you know, from where we might be living in this current moment. But it doesn’t mean that we’re aiming to be millionaires, it just means that we’re being abundant. And in our emotions, we’re being abundant, our mental state, we’re being abundant, our spiritual state. So that to me is like the shift. And once you start asking for help, be ready, because it’s going to come, it might take three months, it’s coming.

Brandon Handley 28:56
So I mean, you’re also not asking, you’re saying that you’re letting go the control, right? So the timing? Well, it’s great if it happens sooner than later. Sounds like you’re also just being open to it and allowing for it to show up when it’s absolutely probably most needed. It’s probably shows up right then.

Jesse Harless 29:17
Yeah, because it could be a friend calling you out. And you’re like, wait, that’s not the help I wanted, but you don’t get it, you don’t get to choose it. And that’s my point, you might start asking for help. And all of a sudden someone calling you out on your behavior that you didn’t even see. And that’s the beauty of it. You can’t dictate then what it is and where the Help is going to come from. So it can be unexpected. But that’s the whole point of staying surrendered and hoping and open to what is to come and, and that whole idea of surrender is not a word that a lot of men like because they’re operating from this wounded masculine idea that they have to do everything themselves. And I did that too. They used to call me stressy Jesse, okay, they used to call me that for a reason. That wasn’t like, you know that people really calling me that It’s because why I try to control everything. I try to control everything. And I try to do everything I could not to ask for help. Even in recovery, I’m talking about no asking for help, you know, oh, I don’t need you. I’ve already been through all this stuff, like all I can do, I’ll just have my own goals. And you know what, that’s why, you know, to tie it back to the intentions because, you know, whoever needed to hear the intention talk like four times is coming up. Because here’s the thing is I was the gold Master, I would set so many goals, I would crush goals. I have all these certifications that I’ve done, not just heart math, all these ones. And part of me having those. Yeah, of course, some is just like, Oh, I want to better myself and get more education. But some of that is unworthiness. I was doing it out of a sense of validation unworthiness. And this is what I mean, when you start to ask for help. You might have a friend who’s very connected to and knows you. And they start to tell you this, that brother you have, you still feel unworthy? And it’s like, Whoa, damn, ouch. And it’s true.

Brandon Handley 30:57
Yeah, that’s not just that, that’s super powerful. As a matter of fact, I was talking to another friend of mine, who’s putting putting some of her stuff together. And she she was just talking about She goes, Well, is it gonna matter that I’ve only been a professional for x, y, z period of time? I’m like, No, I just put yourself out there and start walking towards it. I mean, everybody started at a certain level at some point. And I think to your point, you know, that’s someone worthiness, right? I’m not I’m not good enough to do X, Y, or Z, even though maybe I’m really good at it. Already.

Jesse Harless 31:31
Yeah. I mean, it’s people way more talented than me, Brandon, way more talented to me. Like I meet people all the time. They’re friggin they were professional singers and actors and, and all this stuff. And they’re like, yeah, you know, I don’t want to write a book. And I don’t want to do this. And I’m like, you have like, 10 times the capabilities I have. And I’ve already on my third book. So what do you even mean, you are more qualified than I ever was. And so this is, this is where I think we have this. And this is where I tie it back to what is addiction? People think addiction is their uncle who’s drinking all the time. No, addiction is your emotional addiction to unworthiness. So this is what I mean. And so once we start to see that clearly, we can start to say, Oh, well, then who? How can I ask for help? How can I get some help, so I can start to maintain consistency, accountability, and really go towards these things that I’m avoiding. And, and then that really, on the other side of those things, is where you start to emerge as let’s say, the warrior, but the balanced warrior, you’re not just being this person who’s this tyrant. So I think, you know, these are the lessons I have learned very much later in my recovery, like recently, where, you know, you know, it all just happens in the timing it happens in but you know, this information, could this have benefited me at 18 or 25? And how Oh, my God, yeah. But and so it’s all good. It’s all good, because now I can take it and really appreciate it.

Brandon Handley 32:54
For sure. You mentioned your divine purpose, Jessie, what would you say that is?

Jesse Harless 33:01
Well, you know, I used to just say purpose, I used to just say purpose all the time. Okay, your purpose, and it’s huge. People ask me, what’s the number one kit, what’s the number one reason people stay in addiction recovery, and I’ll tell them purpose, they have some type of purpose. And you know what, like, eventually one day I was like, You know what, it’s if you’re living your purpose that’s divine, like that’s divine, it means that like you’re actually choosing to live from your heart, not just your mind. And that’s simply what it is it’s really choosing to every day to live from my heart space, use my mind as a tool, but realize it’s not my master and being able to live my life from that heart space. So the divine purpose is simply like you know, I’m choosing to use my strengths, I know what my top strengths are. So using my top strengths, to be able to help people to share their stories in the world and me helping to help them to see their strengths and show them that their story is important. So that’s kind of my divine purpose is to help others to share their story in a loving and powerful way and give them a platform to do that. So that’s that’s what I do as a professional facilitator or as a coach is I help people to do that and then they get to try to figure out what their divine purposes but again, here’s what’s cool about your purpose exchanges. So you might be like okay, this is my purpose and guess what Coronavirus hits you know guess what something else hits in your life a storm and you know what it’s all good and your purpose starts to shift and change and that’s cool it evolves so it’s to me it doesn’t have to be a set in stone thing and never is and never has been for me and But yeah, I am I like to think it’s divine.

Brandon Handley 34:42
I look I’m all about it obviously spiritual dope right? Being been in this face and you know the divine is a To me it’s a mindset divinity is a mindset right and grabbing hold of that and then allowing yourself to be filled with that. It’s a game changer. All right. Speaking of spiritual dope you know I always think about like, the whole idea of sounds like you’re you’re you’re hitting a spiritual dope is having somebody see that breakthrough moment or something like that. What are some other like hits a spiritual dope for you when you’re filled with you know, I think you talked about it being being in your flow states what are what’s what’s something that gets in the flow state or into feeling connected to source?

Jesse Harless 35:30
Well I mean I love nature I’m an earthy person, I love being outdoors. I love doing earthing. I never wear shoes, I never wear socks, you’re gonna see me always barefoot every day. 365 even in New Hampshire, you know, like, yeah, I wear shoes when I need to but like I’m barefoot, you know, because I love to be connected to the earth. I live in New Hampshire I have beautiful forest all around me, we got the white far, we got the National Forest not far from me. So I you know, my big thing is connected with nature. So it’s connecting with the wildlife, it’s just, you know, being outside and, and feeling connected to this, like planet where like these little ants on this planet, we think we run everything, we own everything. And it’s like, you know, we got to get humble, because we don’t, and, you know, just feeling connected and part of nature feels, you know, puts me in the flow state. So that’s kind of the end of in my house, you know, where I’m living. You know, you can see behind me, there’s plants everywhere I have plans, I have two big plants right here, I got a huge one back there, that’s over 25 years old, all to the left of me is his, his plants. I have a running waterfall, you know. So these are things that just remind me of what’s important. And, you know, so another way that I get into the flow state is, is is facilitation. Because what I like about it is I’m not that, like I said, the guru, I’m actually asking questions, I’m asking questions that are inquiring into people’s lives or business. And there’ll be they can actually take the time to answer the questions themselves, and then talk to each other. So it’s really, you know, that that makes me excited, because I don’t have all the answers, you know, and I let them crowdsource answers, and then we come up with the best answer together, because the answers that they could come up with a much better than what I could come up, come up with. So it’s, you know, collectively, you know, using our strengths together to, you know, come up with solutions. And by the way, I do this in addiction recovery, I do this for states. So the state of Georgia I work with and I help them to come up with so you know, different solutions to crowdsource addiction recovery. So, you know, these are lived experiences that that helped me to be in that flow state. And you know, I would say my book that I just released. Absolutely. I didn’t think of myself as a writer until I wrote this last book. And I realized, like, oh, maybe I am a writer. I mean, I don’t write every day. But you know, my next book, is the confidence I have to write the next book is because the last book I wrote, when I now I’m doing the audio book, when I’m reading it back to myself, or hearing, I’m like, wow, I actually did a pretty good job with the writing of this book, the actual art of the writing. And so, you know, so guess writing can put you in a flow state to?

Brandon Handley 38:03
Yeah, thanks for sharing that. What’s the what’s the latest book that your

Jesse Harless 38:07
latest book I wrote is called, if not using who harness restraints to shift from addiction to abundance. Nice,

Brandon Handley 38:15
high level, you know, target audience?

Jesse Harless 38:18
Well, the high level is the beginning of the book. The first four chapters is my story. I literally write it like a memoir. So it starts out as a memoir, because if you’re in mental health, or addiction recovery, it’s all about stories. It’s about hearing that story want to connect the stories. So I started off with the story. And then the final five chapters of the book, or the six chapters, but the five chapters the meat of the book is, is this toolkit, it’s a toolkit that I’ve learned from leaving my job and way before leaving the job. But solidifying when I left the job, I started to learn techniques to become an entrepreneur. And so the entrepreneurial techniques that I learned actually tie into addiction recovery, they actually help each other, they feed off each other. Because if you’re an addiction recovery, you’re trying to live a self directed life. And a self directed life is what entrepreneurship is about. So you’re trying to reach your full potential, you’re improving your health and wellness. This is the definition of recovery. And it also applies into entrepreneurship. So the book is like 10 years of things I’ve learned from mentors and coaches. But it’s also recently in the last four or five years learning from mentors like how l rod and john berghoff, and all these different people that came into my direct experience that helped me to see like, Whoa, these are tools we need to be using in addiction recovery. This isn’t stuff we can put off because we’re looking at what’s happening in the world and decline of life of human life with the opioid, you know, issue going on and all the things that are happening, what we’re doing is not working. Some things are a lot or is not so. So the book is is if you say the target audience would be for someone who has a family member or themselves are looking to live their best life because I chose instead of writing a memoir, I chose to write a self help memoir, which has a five chapter toolkit, which is called fears actually.

Brandon Handley 40:06
Okay, what’s that? What’s the acronym stands for?

Jesse Harless 40:10
So fears is focus on your recovery, elevate your recovery, appreciate your recovery, resilience and recovery, self care recovery in the 30 action steps. And within each of those is to me having that, that complete life is to have that abundant life if you’re doing those five actions, which is really 30. But if you’re, if you’re thinking about how do I focus on my recovery every day, your recovery might not be from drugs and alcohol, folks, this is what I’m trying to say here isn’t isn’t just substances. This is this is could be recovery from caretaking recovery from people pleasing every day. And so how do I stop doing that you do the steps in the book that help you to live your purpose. And that’s really where it leads to. And focus, you know, so I won’t break each of them down. But but that’s what it is, it’s a way to, like, what helped me and the men that I’ve been teaching for over a decade in women, but a lot of men, it’s, it’s like, how do I do it? And that’s what I put in the book. It’s like, here’s the start. And then from there, you read your next 10 books, but here’s a book that’s gonna get you started. And, you know, it’s just my life experiences.

Brandon Handley 41:15
Not something sounds powerful Jesse, and I think to the author to the extent of separating men and women from the, I think they’re interesting, obviously, they’re intrinsically different, right? And how this journey goes. And to be able to have somebody such as yourself, you know, that’s really tuned in to how the the male processes this and goes through it, and to have somebody lead them through that. I think that’s really important.

Jesse Harless 41:42
Yeah, absolutely. And what’s ironic is I coach more women than men, but that’s just the way it works out in the private practice, but but in reality, when you’re in early recovery, and then you’re, you know, I left the job, it’s like, you go to a lot of these places, and it’s, and it’s men and women separate. So like, when I was first starting out running workshops, it would be with men. And so and, and then today, I realized, like, yeah, I can run workshops for both. But I can tell you that if I just niche down and start to really focus on men, I’m gonna help a lot of men because a lot of men don’t trust their intuition. A lot of men look at things as weaknesses that are strengths. So this is where, like, kind of my heart is, is to help those men

Brandon Handley 42:22
for sure, for sure, and I think that that you probably found right, especially in Western society, is that men are very head driven, right, and you’re talking about the heart and head coherence piece, and you’re getting them to make that connection and to trust it just a little bit. And I think that that’s, I think that’s powerful. And I think it’s awesome that you’re doing this work, Jesse. So let me break this down for you. We’ve got a little just a little more longer here. And what I like to do here is what I like to call kind of like a spiritual speed dating, just the I’m just gonna pick like one question that this bank of questions and I know there’s somebody out there looking for the next spiritual date, you could be it Jesse. All right, let’s see, we got um what does it mean to live in the present moment?

Jesse Harless 43:11
Yeah, for me, living in the present moments, everything, I spent most of my life with anxiety which is living in the future. So you know, so living in the present moment I do everything I can to live in the present moment, I’m literally standing on a grounding mat that’s connected to the wall right now. So I’m always trying to stay in the present moment. I’m trying to live right here I’m trying to look you in the eye right in this moment, and be with you now. And just just not think just be so that I can just allow whatever is coming out of me to come out of me. I didn’t know what I was gonna say today and that’s how I like to live my life. So that is the present moment as I can clearly hear that subtleness of intuition and be able to trust it that is leading me in the right direction, trust my feelings, I can’t feel my feelings and emotions if I’m not living in the present moment I’m going to be stuck in some type of battle between the future and the past. And I already spent enough time living in the past and I spent a lot of time live in the future so I know when I’m living in the present moment and it’s real simple it’s it’s I can hear my breath I can hear my heartbeat I’m can be with you right here now I can hear him what I’m saying. It’s that’s me being in the present moment. So being in the present moment is everything for you to start to live as connected to your purpose.

Brandon Handley 44:25
God thanks, Jesse. Thanks a lot. The the What else we got here? Get one more for me to do to do. What is your one wish for World Jesse?

Jesse Harless 44:39
It’s a big one. I mean, as a probably a few but I would say one of the big wishes is to understand what addiction really means. And I think if we can start to understand what addiction really means we’re going to change the whole world. So I that’s my hope is to understand the definition of addiction. And to understand that addiction is not simply your uncle who struggle with alcoholism, your addiction is you So that’s going to, we understand that we’re gonna have a lot more compassion for people, we’re going to understand that people are fighting daily battles every single day, your parents are fighting battles, your cousin, you know, all these people are getting these, these these difficult situations that are stemming from addiction. And so I think for me, it’s like, once we start to understand the definition of addiction, that it’s not just a generic genetic brain disease, and you’re doomed. It’s it’s as simple as, like, all I keep doing is I keep going back to my unworthiness every day. That’s my primary addiction. And so when we start to know that type, that there is social emotional addictions, I think that’s going to change the world, because then we’re going to band together as a one as a tribe and say, how can we help each other with our addictions? Because we’re all numbing out in some way.

Brandon Handley 45:46
Yeah, just Yeah, I think that’s powerful. I love how you’ve you’ve kind of reframed addictions beyond, you know, drinking and drugs, and really just kind of put it into a space of a couple of places you put it into that resonate with me is is the numbing out? Yeah. Right. And then, you know, the, the unworthiness, you know, kind of loop right, getting stuck in these loops, as an addiction, right, and recognizing those as as addictions. And, you know, if we band together, like you’re saying, and kind of act as one against the human act as one against it, right, like I come from, you know, what can we do for the positive outcome? Right? What can we do that? I mean, I think that your your, your group runs through some of you guys, what was it? appreciative inquiry, right, I think that’s where I learned from, from from some of them, some of those groups. So what is this positive outcome of understanding the true definition of addiction? And what can we do to kind of break those shackles? Right, break those loops? I love it. I love it. Jesse, where can people go to find out more about you? Who should be working with you? Who should be reaching out to you? Some of that stuff?

Jesse Harless 47:00
Yeah, I mean, if you can find me at my website, Jesse Harless Comm. You know, that’s, that’s probably the best place is a contact form there, you can grab a copy of my journal, I created a journal to go along with the book that’s free, and grab the journal there. So I think that’s probably where you can understand more about me who I work with, and what I’m doing in the world, you know, and I don’t have a big social media following. I learned that from some of my mentors, so that’s actually the most the most, that’s not the most important thing. So it’s quite unprofessional myself with that. So I mean, if you want to really reach out to me, you need help you need something, you know, go ahead and reach out to me, I respond to every single person. So go ahead and reach out and I’m happy to help.

Brandon Handley 47:38
Jesse, I can’t believe you’re saying social media presence isn’t the most important thing. What did you learn from your mentors? That is,

Jesse Harless 47:44
well, I have a mentor who’s very successful in that he has one of the most biggest he has one of the biggest Facebook groups in the world. But I also have one that has no, no social media following, he makes just as much money. So it’s not about money. It’s about impact. And he’s making just as much impact without a social media. So it’s really shows me that either way. So that’s where our ego wants to be like, Oh, it’s the reason I don’t have money is because I only have 1000 followers, and I can prove you wrong with that one. So that’s so that’s what I’m, that’s what I thought I was like, Oh, I need to get the funnel. I need to get the emails, I need to do this. But here’s the thing is, it’s you don’t have to do that you can do without that. But it’s all about specializing, what do you specialize in who you’re speaking to? And having your own platform? You know, and that kind of helps you not to have to create a social media platform if you have your own platform?

Brandon Handley 48:31
For sure, for sure. No, thanks for that response. I mean, I think it’s important to hear that right. And it’s not just important to hear from random people, you’ve you’ve had experience, you know, these people that have, you know, been successful. And I think that we also tend to forget that maybe, I don’t know, less than 20 years ago, there wasn’t a social media and there were plenty of successful people. Yeah, that’s for sure. Right? Right. So Hey, everybody, thanks for checking Jesse out, make sure you go check out his site, Jesse And learn more about him. Jesse, thanks for being on today. I really appreciate what you’re doing.

Jesse Harless 49:05
Yeah, Brandon, thank you so much for reaching out. This is great. I

Unknown Speaker 49:09
really hope you enjoyed this episode of the spiritual dove podcast. stay connected with us directly through spiritual co You can also join the discussion on Facebook, spiritual, and Instagram and spiritual underscore Joe. If you would like to speak with us, send us an email Brandon at spiritual dog Co. And as always, thank you for cultivating your mindset and creating a better reality. This concludes the most thought provoking part of your day. Don’t forget to like and subscribe to stay fully up to date. Until next time, be kind yourself and trust your intuition.

Unknown Speaker 0:01
What’s up,

Brandon Handley 0:03
don’t hit that car. Been a long time since I’ve done a live Facebook Live, that’s for sure. And to be honest with you, I don’t really even know what I’ve got for you today. Other than, you know, Megan, I been, you know, going through like a lot of different things, you know, both of us kind of growing in our own ways. And I think that that is how things are supposed to be in life, people grow the way that they grow. Same way that as I’m passing on nursery, right, you know, an oak tree is gonna grow different than a flower. Right? But the flower and the oak tree aren’t gonna look at each other and be like, why aren’t you growing? Like I’m growing. And I think that, you know, a, that’s the way it’s supposed to be like, in a relationship when one person is not supposed to grow, just like the other. But I also think that there’s going to be, there’s going to be areas of intersection as kind of like almost like a DNA helix, right, there’s going to be areas of intersection overlap. And an area that we were talking about the other day, was talking about, throat being pretty tight, right here. And, you know, just talking about like, throat, throat chakra is and, and speaking, speaking your truth, as it were. And, and, yeah, that’s just kind of what I was feeling. This was really interesting. And I don’t know if it’s because of BJJ. And getting choked out that that could be, but I don’t feel like I got choked out too much in the past couple days. So. So it’s just this is kind of this, this blockage almost in in the throat, from not sharing your truth, not sharing who you are. And I had a great opportunity yesterday to share my truth and kind of speak through this a little bit with a fella named Mike IML, he is on Instagram, check him out really cool guy does, does purpose work, which can be used in a number of different ways. But he and I had a great conversation around what it’s like to not speak your truth. And it’s almost, it’s almost like it’s almost like a darkening yourself, you know, putting, putting a shade on who you are. Because you’re afraid

Unknown Speaker 2:37

Brandon Handley 2:39
maybe shining too bright. You’re afraid of someone you know, disagreeing with you or afraid of someone not accepting you as you are or being accepted as you are in the place that you are. And so you hold back. You hold back your your thoughts, you hold back your emotions, you hold back any number of things. And also had a second conversation yesterday with this gentleman, Don Smith, who who does work in this space as well. And his work is to kind of go back to the area where this was formed. He calls he says it’s like a phobia. And how phobias are created in an instant, right? How quickly does a phobia get created? How quickly did you become when you became afraid of snakes? How quickly did you become afraid of spiders or insects and your reaction became what it is to the things that you react to. And that is he called it a neurological versus intellectual. Right. So that’s that was created intellectually. And it’s really hard to unwrap these triggers these phobias, this phobia of you not being able to be the truth of who you are. And how that how challenging that is going to be to unwrap through a to an intellectual way. And he posits that this phobia can be overcome just as quickly as it was created. That is instant instantly. However, it has to be done in a neurological kind of way, that he’s found the way that he is found, helps to remedy this in a three to four hour session, and you know, walks you through a path and then gets you to this place where he’s got what he calls like, dual sound device,

Unknown Speaker 5:19
double sound, if

Brandon Handley 5:20
I’d have to look at it again, but essentially, the way I like and is, you know, there’s there’s a ultrasonic devices that clean, clean debris off of off of like scalpels off of when you’re doing your teeth, you know, dental instruments. And the thought is, is like what is what is doing is it’s sending such a vibration, it’s such a level that it’s physical. It’s not, it’s emotional, rather, really. And that’s also what we’re talking about is this emotional bond is created, is created at an emotional level, like emotional vibrational level, I would have to say, Don, even though we’re not talking right now, that such that it kind of clasps and hooks itself into such a position that it’s locked for forever, almost. And then you’ve got to some of these associates vibrations, to disrupt that, that grasp, right, to disrupt it. That was the way I kind of envisioned it when he talks about what he does, but he walks you through the path talks about how you get there. And, you know, it’s kind of tragic, when you think about it, the amount of people that aren’t sharing the truth of who they are. Maybe, because I know often in my own is, since I’m like, well, maybe it’s just not going to come across in a way that’s easily understood, which is a challenge, right? Since that’s a work on the communication aspect become a better communicator, when you’re trying to really share what it is that you believe could work. And, you know, sometimes there’s more work that goes into it that you just haven’t done yet. So the challenge and trying to get somebody to understand something new is to work with them to understand it, right. So there’s a little bit of dance in the conversation before you get to that spot. But I think that we’ve all been in a situation where we’re with someone, and we want to make a good impression we want to make, we just want to be seen, right want to see, we want us to be seen in a good way, the way that they would accept this good, if that makes sense, right? So that we want to be seen by them in a way that is acceptable to them. And that causes a challenge because we don’t really know all the ways that they will accept us as as the person they want us to be or they would accept. So the alternative is to simply just be who you are, be who you are in that moment. And finish this up, I guess with the class that I’ve been taking Craven personal mastery with Sreekumar Rao, and just some other just amazing people. It’s a group of I think, just shy of 20 people from around the world. And it’s been a 12 week course. And the interaction with some of these people, the access to some people would be access to people that I would never imagine myself to be surrounded by see CFOs entrepreneurs of highest caliber, you know, world renowned people in their space. And here I am. And you know, there’s this voice of judgment there for myself and like, Who am I supposed to be in this situation? You know, I’ve come into this through the route of spiritual dose should I be like the super spiritual dude and all this stuff where you know, or can I just be me or whoever I need to be? What’s my reaction? What’s my gut, telling me? What’s my heart telling me and how is my heart telling me to speak in this situation. And I think that when we when we speak from our heart, if anybody’s ever done some, some research on this to research is showing that the reaction there’s an emotion and there’s like a tiny little brain, like I think it’s like 40,000 cells within the heart that seems to be able to intercept what’s going to happen to you As much as six seconds before it actually happens to you. So your heart and your emotion reacts prior to any event happening within your life. And a lot of times we disregard that, that in that initial instinct, the thing that

is there from our heart, right, not intellectually, not thinking to ourselves, oh, what’s he going to say, and, versus just saying what’s on, you know, coming from

Unknown Speaker 10:32
your heart,

Brandon Handley 10:33
this emotion, this, this truth, as it were. And when you when you follow that, you’re just being who you’re being, you’re not trying to be somebody that you’re not. You’re not even trying to be your authentic self. Because when you’re trying to be your authentic self, when you’re trying to do anything. You know, you’re, you’ve got in your mind that you’re trying, first of all, you’ve got in your mind that this isn’t who you are, versus just doing the thing, versus just being the thing, right. So instead of trying to

Unknown Speaker 11:11

Brandon Handley 11:13
just like, you know, you’re Oh, man, hold on a second, we got to merge, oh, this guy’s not gonna let me do it. You gotta let me do it. Come on, man. You’re gonna make me go that fast. All right. All right.

Unknown Speaker 11:23

Brandon Handley 11:25
instead of trying to be something just be in the moment. Right, we talked about Who Are You Being was one of the final concepts of this course that we’re in, who are you being in the moment, and you can be whoever you want to be in that moment. But just be conscious of that. went on, I’m with my children. And, you know, we’re doing our things in my, you know, in my, I’m just being there. I’m not trying to be Dad, I’m not trying to be Brandon, I’m not trying to be spiritual dope, I’m not trying to be anything other than who I am. And when you’re, when you’re doing and being who you are, and you’re speaking from the heart, and you’re letting it all go, you’re freeing yourself, right? You’re freeing yourself, you’re liberating your own. You’re freeing your third chakra, you’re, you’re loosening that up. And that’s, you know, speaking your truth. And that was just something that I know that I was thinking of, this morning, on the way into BJJ, as I felt like I said that my throat tightened up a little bit. And to me, feels like an intersection between both Mike and I are having our own personal spiritual journeys, as it were. And to me, this is a this is an intersection, this is where we’re both kind of having having this thing and and the thing is, is that we’re gonna both handle it differently. She’s gonna process the way that she’s going to process this, and it’s going to benefit her, and she’s going to have her growth, the way that she’ll have her growth, just the same way that I’ll process mine in a different way as well. And it’ll be it’ll be different for me. The same way that an oak tree grows different from a daffodil, it’s the same way that the two of us are grown in our relationship. Neither one is better or greater than another. They’re just different. And in a way that I know that I appreciate her and what she’s going through and how she grows. And you know, I know that she tells me that she appreciates the way that I’m growing and what I’m going through and so, you know, I put that out there for people who are in a relationship a, you know, to just kind of look at it in that way, especially if you’re in one of those relationships where maybe you feel like you’re having this crazy growth, you’re having a growth spurt. And you’re wondering what what’s going to happen with your loved one Why aren’t they good? They’re not growing like you. Of course, they’re not that’s the fucking poster bro. Like you do. They grow like they do. And you just, you know, if you’re married, you love me unconditionally, right? You love them for what it is that they’re going through what is they’re teaching you if they’re triggering you, that’s within you. What are the triggers within you that you can address so that you’re no longer triggered by the things that you’ve been triggered by right if you’re, if you’re reacting to a trigger, you’re reacting to a subconscious a subconscious thing that that’s making you feel a certain way that you don’t you don’t want to feel and and react acting in a way that you may not have a positive outcome. So, I don’t know if those are those are most of the things I have in this morning’s conversation. So thanks for checking it out, checked it out. And if you haven’t checked out the podcast check it out spiritual dope. co has some great guests on there, Eric nice. It’s been a recent one. Trying to think who I just released this weekend that was another I think really enjoyable one. just just just the the guests I think are have been amazing. And you know, I think the listeners and the people that have reached out, continue to be amazing continue to give me encouragement to keep going and so it makes me makes me keep going. So check that out. And we’ll talk later

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